Using PPPoE and DMZ / Advanced DMZ for 'Bridge Mode' use of 3rd Party router on the HH4000 & Giga Hub

[navderek]

It would be great if Bell could confirm if they are going to update the FW on the HH4000 to enable a true bridge mode setup...also to stop the Wifi from automatically re-enabling itself anytime the HH4000 reboots itself. These are two MAJOR issues right now with the HH4000 and posted about on many forums (not just here).

It would be great if someone from Bell could chime in and let the community know if it is actually going to address these issues or not? If not, please explain why and please do not point to advanced DMZ as a solution because that doesn't actually work very well and severely impacts the performance on the Google Mesh (or any other pre-existing mesh setup). This is also discussed on many forums both on this one and externally by your customers.

We do realize the HH4000 is relatively new so there can be some improvements. We, as a community, just want to know if Bell plans to make those improvements or not.

Thanks,

-Derek

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❗AI Summary: 

When attempting to use a third-party router, customers frequently encounter networking challenges due to the absence of a true 'bridge mode'. This limitation has led to a variety of solutions involving PPPoE and the Advanced DMZ feature to avoid issues like double NAT; where two devices on the network are performing Network Address Translation (NAT). Double NAT can lead to problems with online gaming, port forwarding, and other applications that require a direct connection to the internet.

Some complications you may experience:

• Wi-Fi auto re-enabling: Even when disabled, the Bell Home Hub's Wi-Fi can turn back on after a reboot.
• Advanced DMZ limitations: Advanced DMZ can be unreliable, especially with third party mesh systems. PPPoE is preferred by users in this scenario.
• IP lease and connectivity drops: Devices lose connection when the public IP changes, requiring manual reconfiguration.
• Performance degradation: Speeds, especially download speeds can drop over time. A reboot or modem reset will be needed to restore.
• No static IPs: IP changes cause disruptions. Using DDNS can be considered.

In response, Bell Community users have detailed two primary methods to approximate a bridge mode: PPPoE passthrough and the use of the Advanced DMZ feature.

User-Shared Solutions:

PPPoE Passthrough: Often described as more stable and straightforward; it involves configuring the third-party router to establish the PPPoE connection directly with Bell. This effectively bypasses the Bell Home Hub 4000, Giga Hub and Giga Hub 2.0's routing functions, providing the third-party router with its own public IP address. To do this, users typically need to obtain their "b1" username and password from Bell. While stable, a significant drawback of this method is a potential reduction in internet speeds, particularly on plans faster than 500 Mbps, as many consumer routers struggle with the overhead of PPPoE.

Advanced DMZ: This method involves placing the third-party router in the modem's "Advanced Demilitarized Zone." This exposes the third-party router directly to the internet, which can result in higher performance. However, this solution is often reported to be less stable. For instance, rebooting your router might necessitate a subsequent reboot of your Giga Hub/Giga Hub 2.0 to restore the internet connection. Some have also reported experiencing lag spikes with this configuration. When using Advanced DMZ, it is advised to leave the login information on the third-party router blank, as entering PPPoE credentials can cause the connection to fail.

Configuration Tips from the Bell Community:

• When setting up either method, it's recommended to disable the Wi-Fi on the Bell Giga Hub/Giga Hub 2.0 to prevent interference.
• For PPPoE passthrough, connecting the WAN port of the third-party router to any LAN port on the Bell hub and configuring the router with your b1 credentials is the general procedure.
• For Advanced DMZ, users need to enable the feature in the Giga Hub/Giga Hub 2.0's settings and assign their third-party router to it. It's also highly recommended to not plug other devices directly into the Bell hub for security reasons when using Advanced DMZ.

Ultimately, the choice between PPPoE passthrough and Advanced DMZ depends on the user's priorities. If stability and ease of setup are paramount, PPPoE passthrough is often the recommended choice. For those who prioritize performance and are willing to troubleshoot potential instabilities, Advanced DMZ may be the preferred option.

[dks]

To the best of my knowledge, that is not true. At least not yet. 

[Inf]

UniFi Express Fails to Aquire Internet Access on External IP Using Advanced DMZ

Hi,

I have a UniFi Express connected to a HH3000 with advanced DMZ enabled. I can't get the express to acquire the external IP and have internet access. If I restart the express, it acquires the external IP but no internet access. If I then restart the HH3000, the express has internet access but acquires a local IP (e.g. 192.168.0.13). How can I get it to acquire the external IP and get internet access? PPPoE passthrough works fine but ideally I want to offload PPPoE to the HH3000 to reduce CPU usage.

HH3000 Config

• Firmware 3.4.14.3
• Advanced DMZ enabled and set to UniFi Express MAC address
• DHCP enabled with HH3000 IP set to 192.168.0.1 (to prevent DHCP conflicts with UniFi express)

UniFi Express Configuration

• UniFi OS 4.0.4
• UniFi Network 8.3.32
• Internet Settings 
  • IPv4 Configuration: DHCPv4
  • DNS Server: Auto
  • IPv6 Configuration: off
    
• Static Routes (from https://www.reddit.com/r/bell/comments/13zzz2s/successful_3gbit_bell_fiber_with_udm_pro_se_gtek/)
  • Bell 1
    • Distance: 1
    • Destination Network: 0.0.0.0/1
    • Type: Interface (WAN)
  • Bell 2
    
    • Distance: 1
    • Destination Network: 128.0.0.0/1
    • Type: Interface (WAN)

[Indirectelex]

you answer is sooo late, I found other solutions for my problems... thank you but no thanks man.

[dks]

Thank you for the outline of your system. The deeper technical solution you are looking for is beyond the scope of the Community Forum. Bell does not support customer provided equipment connected to the modem. I encourage you to post your questions in the Bell user forum on DSL Reports or in the Bell sub Reddit. There are very experienced users there who can offer their advice to you. 

[dks]

I am not sure what you mean by “late”,  but as consumers we all have choices. I am glad you found solutions which work for you. There are always many solutions. 

[Inf]

Thanks! I’ll check with dslreports.

[Retiredandbored]

With most companies we are the beta testers but unlike big companies like Microsoft and others we did not get a choice. The changes just get dumped on us with no input on what the changes mean and little dedicated support to help us through the challenges. Welcome to low end poor quality testing and implementation at the end user level. Ie the consumer. 

[Retiredandbored]

It doesn't hurt to ask here too. There seems to be some highly knowledgeable users here who have a deep knowledge basis to work from. Gone are the days when one solution from an ISP fit all. Technology has become far too diverse and the iso standards for compatibility of technology are often biased such as a combined user restricted gateway of modem and router rather than two separately configured devices with choice to meet the users individual and often complex devices. 

So keep posting the ideas. Maybe a universal solution can be found for some situations and be added to support documents but personally I doubt it. 

[flyaway1999]

hi, im trying to figure out how to reach my modem through the 192.168.2.1 ip address (gigahub) but for some reason its not working. only through a wired connection. im using the internet through a router in dmz the internet is doing fine but i cant seem to reach the modem. it was working at some point but now it just doesnt. i tried putting the moddem on a different subnet like 192.168.3.1 but its still not working. is there some configuration i should do that i dont know about??

thank you

[dks]

Thank you for your question. I believe that when you bypass the Giga Hub with your own router in the DMZ, you bypass access to the hub itself. That's what being in the the DMZ means. If you use a connection to the Giga Hub through another wired connection and another port, you can access the configuration page and the internet. 

[dks]

Thank you for your thoughts. With respect to Bell, they actually do testing of everything before a general release to the customer base. It has been this way for decades. Many years ago, NBTel was used as the full scale system test for Bell services. We has services that appeared two years later in Ontario. When Bell opened the internet to the public in the 1990's, Bell staff had used it for several months before the public roll out. Today, modem firmware is alpha and beta tested internally with Bell before being rolled out. The challenge, as you correctly point out, is the diversity of end-user configurations. That makes some kind of complete universality that can work with every single possible user configuration very difficult at many levels. 

The Community All-Stars are not product specialists, employees of Bell but generally are experienced users. The Bell staff, identified by the tag "Moderator" keep eyes on the Community Form and will answer questions as well, often in private messages.

Keep asking questions (politely, please). It's how we all learn.  

[flyaway1999]

at some point it was working fine but then it stopped working. i figured i must had touched something unknowingly

[Vanadiel]

What is your local IP address and your default gateway address?

[alexandreptito]

hi, so to day a techician came because i was having trouble with my home phone and in the process did a factory reset of my modem. now i had a router plugged inside there in dmz and now, no matter what ethernet port i use, nothing is detected in in the bell modem interface when i check connected devices. i tried rebooting the modem and still didnt work. theres light in the back of the ethernet ports showing theres an exchange of information and signals going through but no devices can be chosen back to put in dmz. (gigahub by the way)

[Vanadiel]

Make sure the home hub is in DMZ or ADMZ, and after that reboot your router.